1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:20,610 *36C3 preroll music* 2 00:00:20,610 --> 00:00:26,470 Herald: Our next speaker Régine Debatty will help you and explain you the Internet 3 00:00:26,470 --> 00:00:31,100 of rubbish, things and bodies and basically everything around e-waste. Thank 4 00:00:31,100 --> 00:00:38,290 you very much and welcome. *applause* Régine Debatty: Can I get ... can I get 5 00:00:38,290 --> 00:00:41,970 less light to my face? Herald: Slide in your face? 6 00:00:41,970 --> 00:00:46,730 RD: Less light to my face. Herald: Slide? 7 00:00:46,730 --> 00:00:49,590 RD: Light. Can I get less light in my face? 8 00:00:49,590 --> 00:00:53,210 Herald: OK. A little bit less light for the speaker. 9 00:00:53,210 --> 00:00:58,480 RD: Yeah. Hello. Good evening, everyone. First of all, I want to say thank you to 10 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:03,390 Nora, to Gregor and to everybody, at the Chaos Communication Congress for welcoming 11 00:01:03,390 --> 00:01:10,590 me again this year. So I've been tasked with the mission, just like in 2018, to 12 00:01:10,590 --> 00:01:15,410 present to you some of the most interesting and exciting works in art and 13 00:01:15,410 --> 00:01:21,890 technology of this past year. And just like last year, I kind of went on my own 14 00:01:21,890 --> 00:01:26,930 way and went on a tangent and started adopting a tunnel vision. And for some 15 00:01:26,930 --> 00:01:32,110 reason I realized I was obsessed with e-waste. So you're going to hear a lot 16 00:01:32,110 --> 00:01:37,970 about e-waste and nuclear waste in the coming hour. But still, I promise it's 17 00:01:37,970 --> 00:01:44,050 still going to be reasonably interesting, hopefully. And most of the projects are 18 00:01:44,050 --> 00:01:50,810 anyway from 2019. So why did I get interested and why did I think it would be 19 00:01:50,810 --> 00:01:55,080 a good idea to talk to you about e-waste? First of all, there was the the theme of 20 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:59,560 this year's Congress "Resource Exhaustion". I just decided to put some 21 00:01:59,560 --> 00:02:04,940 more, let's say, ecological twist on it. And then the second reason why I wanted to 22 00:02:04,940 --> 00:02:09,940 talk about e-waste is that a couple of months ago, I went to see an exhibition of 23 00:02:09,940 --> 00:02:15,030 a Swiss photographer who has spent four years, something like that, traveling 24 00:02:15,030 --> 00:02:20,500 around the world and trying to understand why transhumanists wanted to change and so 25 00:02:20,500 --> 00:02:26,690 called augment and improve their body. And so he documented everything he found and 26 00:02:26,690 --> 00:02:32,890 how humans nowadays are changing their bodies, either to go from disable body to 27 00:02:32,890 --> 00:02:39,270 able body or from able body to superable body. And one way you can augment your 28 00:02:39,270 --> 00:02:48,660 body is, you know, is with RFID chip that you can implant and that allows you to get 29 00:02:48,660 --> 00:02:54,780 access to offices, open your car door or even pay for public transport. And I've 30 00:02:54,780 --> 00:03:05,940 been told recently that RFID chips are the new tattoo. And then you can also get 31 00:03:05,940 --> 00:03:10,980 magnets implanted underneath your finger that allows you to sense electromagnetic 32 00:03:10,980 --> 00:03:16,080 fields. And actually, the first time I heard about this, I was at least 10 years 33 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:20,520 ago, it was one of the first Chaos Communication Congress I attended in good 34 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:27,120 old Berlin. And there was this this journalist called Queen Nocturne. And she 35 00:03:27,120 --> 00:03:31,240 came to explain that she had just had a magnet implanted and explained that the 36 00:03:31,240 --> 00:03:36,640 new experience and how she felt magnetic fields. Anyway, I could multiply the 37 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:42,460 example. But of course, the people who are really at the cutting edge of body 38 00:03:42,460 --> 00:03:50,030 improvement and augmentation are the Transhumanists. This is one of them, Igor 39 00:03:50,030 --> 00:03:56,580 Trapeznikov is part of the Russian Transhumanists Community. He had a number 40 00:03:56,580 --> 00:04:04,140 of implants, you know, the usual RFID chips, but also a device that turns its 41 00:04:04,140 --> 00:04:10,870 sights into sound, which is usually useful for people who have a vision problem or 42 00:04:10,870 --> 00:04:18,600 who are blind. And then, of course, they are addition to the body or correction of 43 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,680 the body that are there for to a particular reason. That's how some find 44 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:28,510 themselves with bits of titanium in the knee or in the shoulder. And they use this 45 00:04:28,510 --> 00:04:33,410 kind of screw. I think that's one of the images in the series that I found the most 46 00:04:33,410 --> 00:04:37,560 impressive, the idea that when I get older, I might get these kind of screws 47 00:04:37,560 --> 00:04:46,180 inside my body. Pacemaker, of course. And what makes pacemaker interesting is that 48 00:04:46,180 --> 00:04:53,500 it was one of the first electronic devices that found its way inside our bodies. So 49 00:04:53,500 --> 00:05:00,059 it became kind of emblematic of the coming mechanization of the human body. And then, 50 00:05:00,059 --> 00:05:06,230 of course, there are the other devices that communicate with electronics that you 51 00:05:06,230 --> 00:05:11,560 insert in the body and that communicate with phones and computers. So that's why 52 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:14,790 so much talking about the Internet of Bodies, you know, after the Internet of 53 00:05:14,790 --> 00:05:19,969 Things, there ist the Internet of Bodies. So this is a bio artificial pancreas for 54 00:05:19,969 --> 00:05:29,520 people who suffer from Diabetes Type 1. There are so many smart devices that can 55 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:35,580 be added on your body or inside your body. I've heard about smart contact lenses and 56 00:05:35,580 --> 00:05:40,910 also smart prosthetics. And after seeing this exhibition, I started looking at 57 00:05:40,910 --> 00:05:47,300 people around me with a different eye. I am wondering who else had bits of metals 58 00:05:47,300 --> 00:05:53,789 and electricity and electronics inside their body. So that's where my obsession 59 00:05:53,789 --> 00:05:58,809 with with e-waste came because my immediate question after this is what 60 00:05:58,809 --> 00:06:06,080 happens after you died? What happens to that? I don't know if you're interested, 61 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:11,309 but I had to do some research. So if you are buried the traditional way, you buried 62 00:06:11,309 --> 00:06:18,879 with with all your gadgets and gizmos and anything orthopedic. If you're cremated, 63 00:06:18,879 --> 00:06:24,880 you're not cremated with your pacemaker because it contains batteries that could 64 00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:29,919 explode. And then I learn about the new very interesting service. I mean, to me, 65 00:06:29,919 --> 00:06:33,400 it sounded quite interesting. It is that when you are cremated, of course, the 66 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:41,719 titanium or any metal, they do not burn. There is this company who retrieves all 67 00:06:41,719 --> 00:06:46,789 the metal that is found among the ashes. There's just a couple of companies around 68 00:06:46,789 --> 00:06:54,169 the world who do that. They just recover all the metals, they divide them according 69 00:06:54,169 --> 00:07:00,019 to the types of metal. And then they melt them down into ingots, which they sell to 70 00:07:00,019 --> 00:07:06,499 the medical industry, but also to the Car Industry and the Aeronautical Industry. So 71 00:07:06,499 --> 00:07:12,610 that means that parts of these bodies are going to become part of a car or a plane 72 00:07:12,610 --> 00:07:21,509 one day. And I also started imagining that probably in the future, archeologists will 73 00:07:21,509 --> 00:07:27,879 find skeletons with e-waste. We will be buried simply with our e-waste. They will 74 00:07:27,879 --> 00:07:35,150 find bits of metals in the shape of bones and then the rusty electronics. So that's 75 00:07:35,150 --> 00:07:45,369 really what set me on the path of starting to see e-waste absolutely everywhere. I 76 00:07:45,369 --> 00:07:51,409 never miss an opportunity to show my dog because I realized that he has an RFID 77 00:07:51,409 --> 00:07:59,150 chip and apparently all pets are buried with them. Anyway splendid animal. So 78 00:07:59,150 --> 00:08:04,550 since I'm thinking about e-waste it's difficult not to mention one of the icons 79 00:08:04,550 --> 00:08:10,800 of e-waste. It's Agbogbloshie. I'm sure you've seen the picture. I'm going to show 80 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:16,060 images, but I'm not going to tell you the whole story because I'm sure you've seen 81 00:08:16,060 --> 00:08:24,069 all these images. It's located in Accra, the capital of Ghana. And that's where 82 00:08:24,069 --> 00:08:33,120 full containers of electric and electronic trash end up. And the press really like to 83 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:37,680 talk about it and say "Oh, this is where your data and your your devices go to 84 00:08:37,680 --> 00:08:43,860 die." It's a huge place. And you've seen the images of these young people who spend 85 00:08:43,860 --> 00:08:50,420 the whole day dissecting your devices and trying to separate different types of 86 00:08:50,420 --> 00:08:58,200 precious metals such as aluminum, silver, copper, etc.. Of course, they're working 87 00:08:58,200 --> 00:09:04,920 in terrible condition. It's very toxic to work there. They all suffer from terrible 88 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:10,270 headaches, difficulty sleeping problem, respiratory problem, untreated wounds, 89 00:09:10,270 --> 00:09:16,980 etc. But it's really usually the way the press is depicting what's happening and 90 00:09:16,980 --> 00:09:20,960 what the press is really not depicting the full story and that there are bits and 91 00:09:20,960 --> 00:09:27,720 pieces missing in the narratives. First of all, I think we are not conscious enough 92 00:09:27,720 --> 00:09:35,880 of these people playing a really important role for us because they retrieve metals 93 00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:40,560 and we have the feeling that metals are everywhere. But on the surface and 94 00:09:40,560 --> 00:09:47,280 underneath the earth some of them are going to be more and more difficult to 95 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:54,500 retrieve. This year, UNESCO's declared the year of the periodic table. And you can 96 00:09:54,500 --> 00:10:00,660 see on this periodic table that the dot seen in red and orange are the types of 97 00:10:00,660 --> 00:10:05,490 elements that are going to be more and more difficult to mine and to retrieve. 98 00:10:05,490 --> 00:10:10,740 And I like to show these graphics a bit. It is all not very precise, but it shows 99 00:10:10,740 --> 00:10:20,090 the trend. So if ever you have a child or brother was born in 2010, by the time your 100 00:10:20,090 --> 00:10:25,400 child or your brother or your sister is 20, there will be no antimony, no lead 101 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:30,910 left to mine. Very little indium, very little zinc, very little silver, almost no 102 00:10:30,910 --> 00:10:39,220 gold. These elements will still be there, but it's just going to cost more and more 103 00:10:39,220 --> 00:10:44,681 energy and more and more money to retrieve them. So that's why you have this project 104 00:10:44,681 --> 00:10:51,250 of mining very deep into the ocean or even mining asteroids for the same kind of 105 00:10:51,250 --> 00:10:59,060 metals that we need. And I think it was so that we kind of have a blind spot for 106 00:10:59,060 --> 00:11:03,211 metals. We forget. We take them for granted. And when we think about the 107 00:11:03,211 --> 00:11:10,460 challenges of the environment, we tend to focus on energy. And energy is important. 108 00:11:10,460 --> 00:11:15,970 But when you think about renewable energy, we have the feeling it's zero emission, 109 00:11:15,970 --> 00:11:23,530 but it still has a big impact on the environment. And I like to talk about 110 00:11:23,530 --> 00:11:30,030 these solar thermal plant. It's a famous one. It's a very, very big one. It's in in 111 00:11:30,030 --> 00:11:37,520 Southern California. As you can see, it's vast and actually, when it was built 112 00:11:37,520 --> 00:11:43,730 conservation biologist were very concerned because essentially it was built on a 113 00:11:43,730 --> 00:11:50,130 really environmentally intact desert habitat for a number of animals which were 114 00:11:50,130 --> 00:11:55,240 in danger, such as tortoise that had to be moved by hands and put on a truck and 115 00:11:55,240 --> 00:11:59,830 relocated elsewhere. Some of them died out of stress. You might have heard that, too. 116 00:11:59,830 --> 00:12:06,880 So birds and bats by the thousands every year, they did die because of the heat and 117 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:11,530 the radiation. And also you see the surface of the earth that this is 118 00:12:11,530 --> 00:12:15,940 occupying. It's really huge. And they think it's not a coincidence if the 119 00:12:15,940 --> 00:12:25,040 opening sequence of the sequel of Blade Runner 2049 starts with these seemingly 120 00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:36,550 endless landscape of solar panels that are necessary to power modern life. As I said, 121 00:12:36,550 --> 00:12:42,470 I think we we don't perceive the importance of materials and how many 122 00:12:42,470 --> 00:12:48,390 components extracted from the earth are inside any object that surround us. So I'm 123 00:12:48,390 --> 00:12:53,690 going to show a couple of example of of design work and artworks that try to make 124 00:12:53,690 --> 00:13:02,039 it visible, the elements that are inside our electronics or electric objects. So 125 00:13:02,039 --> 00:13:08,410 the first one is by these designers Studio Drift. They have a series where they 126 00:13:08,410 --> 00:13:15,670 decompose all kinds of objects. I'll show a few of them. They can be bikes. They can 127 00:13:15,670 --> 00:13:22,430 be a mobile phone. In this case, it's an iPhone model from 2010. It can be hovers. 128 00:13:22,430 --> 00:13:28,820 I'll show a few examples. They dissect them and they analyzed the elements that 129 00:13:28,820 --> 00:13:32,820 compose them. And then they reconstruct these elements in the form of these 130 00:13:32,820 --> 00:13:39,490 geometrical shape. I want to show a few of them. So that was the iPhone. That's good 131 00:13:39,490 --> 00:13:49,510 old Nokia from 1999. When you see them in an exhibition, they're really tiny. And I 132 00:13:49,510 --> 00:13:53,280 think we saw that some elements are simply not represented. If you think about rare 133 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:59,400 earths, some of them are presenting in smartphone in really tiny quantities like 134 00:13:59,400 --> 00:14:07,100 less than half a gram. But I couldn't find another image. But this is very big. So 135 00:14:07,100 --> 00:14:12,790 this is the representation of a Volkswagen Beetle from 1980. And so that took a lot 136 00:14:12,790 --> 00:14:18,250 of space. And you see an element appear that I was really not expecting, such as 137 00:14:18,250 --> 00:14:26,820 horse hair and also corc. This is an electic cable. So, you know, a bit of 138 00:14:26,820 --> 00:14:35,060 copper and a lot of plastic for one meter. That's my favorite, the Kalashnikov. You 139 00:14:35,060 --> 00:14:42,940 see the the bullets in the front. And when I went to see the first time this 140 00:14:42,940 --> 00:14:47,300 exhibition and if I didn't look at the label, I had no idea what was what, I 141 00:14:47,300 --> 00:14:52,720 could not recognize anything. So it shows the level of ignorance of at least people 142 00:14:52,720 --> 00:15:00,010 like me. But that I could recognize - a pencil. That I could manage. So that's the 143 00:15:00,010 --> 00:15:06,820 last one. That's a light bulb. That's one way to visualize the elements that 144 00:15:06,820 --> 00:15:16,940 surround us. It's very designy, quite elegant and charming. But I also like 145 00:15:16,940 --> 00:15:23,010 artists who adopt a more brutal strategy. So Dani Ploeger also wanted to show the 146 00:15:23,010 --> 00:15:28,010 inside - well, that was one of his objectives at least - to see the inside of 147 00:15:28,010 --> 00:15:36,830 electronic devices. So the first part of his project started back in 2012 and 17 he 148 00:15:36,830 --> 00:15:43,260 infiltrated Phillips and got hired, as you know, this guy. You see them at these 149 00:15:43,260 --> 00:15:48,540 consumer goods fairs that try to sell it, to sell you gadgets and say what is going 150 00:15:48,540 --> 00:15:54,080 to change your life? And here is what this can do. So he was he was hired to to sell 151 00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:59,220 a highly sophisticated shaver for men. And the reason why he wanted to be there is if 152 00:15:59,220 --> 00:16:04,180 you wanted to understand exactly what were the dynamics and the logic behind the 153 00:16:04,180 --> 00:16:09,810 constant rapid innovation behind our electronics. So that was the first part. 154 00:16:09,810 --> 00:16:19,320 He got his hands on confidential material that really explain how people at Philips 155 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:24,160 have these teams - I say Philips but I'm sure it's the same elsewhere, of course - 156 00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:30,400 they really analyze the different types of consumer that we are and find the best way 157 00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:37,490 to to trick us and to lure us and seduce us into buying new products. And then the 158 00:16:37,490 --> 00:16:44,470 second part of his project was this year where he bought this machine. It's a 159 00:16:44,470 --> 00:16:51,780 machine that is called industrial stress testing machine. So it's several of these 160 00:16:51,780 --> 00:16:56,910 machines, you can buy them. He bought this one on Alibaba in China. And they're 161 00:16:56,910 --> 00:17:03,730 usually used by makers of whichever mobile phone, whatever, and they simulate all 162 00:17:03,730 --> 00:17:09,309 kinds of accidents that can happen to your device like you walking on it or dropping 163 00:17:09,309 --> 00:17:17,990 it. I'm going to show a video of this one. *video of machine in action is shown* 164 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:43,370 So that's our poor shaver inside. I like the machine because, you know, it has a 165 00:17:43,370 --> 00:17:48,560 bit of a vintage feel inside. The object that it tests are quite sophisticated and 166 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:54,360 very, very much 21st century. But when you see the the control panel, it seems to be 167 00:17:54,360 --> 00:18:00,929 stuck in the mid 20th century. It has these kind of old design. Apparently it 168 00:18:00,929 --> 00:18:05,790 was a nightmare to get it shipped to to Europe. It costs more to get it shipped 169 00:18:05,790 --> 00:18:12,480 than the machine itself. And if you're like me and you could watch this video for 170 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:17,690 hours of the arm rotating and breaking things, and if you live in Leipzig, the 171 00:18:17,690 --> 00:18:22,270 machine is going to come to the Museum of Fine Art in March as part of an exhibition 172 00:18:22,270 --> 00:18:30,370 called Zero Waste. So the reason why he did this, like, obscene display of 173 00:18:30,370 --> 00:18:37,860 destruction of luxury goods was that you had two reasons for doing that. First of 174 00:18:37,860 --> 00:18:45,760 all, the first reason was, is that usually when we think about consumer culture and 175 00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:52,050 how we consume too much and throw away too much and and waste and the onus usually is 176 00:18:52,050 --> 00:18:57,180 on the consumer. You know, the consumer is wrong, and yeah, we are wrong. We buy too 177 00:18:57,180 --> 00:19:04,660 much. But then the wrong starts actually much further upstream. It starts 178 00:19:04,660 --> 00:19:10,730 everywhere in the line of production and especially in the design and research and 179 00:19:10,730 --> 00:19:17,470 development teams who engineer constantly new ways to seduce us and to convince us 180 00:19:17,470 --> 00:19:25,050 that we have to update. And then another reason why he did this project is that is 181 00:19:25,050 --> 00:19:31,961 that he wanted to to make a comment on maker spaces, which, you know, are very 182 00:19:31,961 --> 00:19:37,430 interesting, but still feeding on this vocabulary of entrepreneurship, 183 00:19:37,430 --> 00:19:44,870 innovation, progress. But they never really, truly and deeply and and they 184 00:19:44,870 --> 00:19:52,040 don't really challenge in a systemic way consumerism. So he saw this laboratory of 185 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:58,970 electric electronic aging as a kind of make up space for unmaking things. And 186 00:19:58,970 --> 00:20:06,080 also you get to see what's inside this piece of electronic. But I would like to 187 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:11,430 go back to Aghogbloshie again, because if there are people who know very well what's 188 00:20:11,430 --> 00:20:16,520 inside our electronics and what they are made of it's the workers of Aghogbloshie. 189 00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:20,580 And sometimes, you know, when we think about this kind of place and I think the 190 00:20:20,580 --> 00:20:25,630 example of Aghogbloshie, but as I'm sure you know, there are equal sites elsewhere 191 00:20:25,630 --> 00:20:31,390 in Africa, in Asia and Bangladesh et cetera. We have the feeling that this is a 192 00:20:31,390 --> 00:20:38,540 big junkyard and that it's a kind of huge mess and it's it's dark and it's dirty. 193 00:20:38,540 --> 00:20:44,790 But this is a map done by architects, designers and activist who spent a lot of 194 00:20:44,790 --> 00:20:50,060 time in Aghogbloshie. And you probably cannot read - well, you probably all have 195 00:20:50,060 --> 00:20:55,160 better eyes than me, but it's still written very small - they map the 196 00:20:55,160 --> 00:21:00,111 activities in Aghogbloshie. And if you read the map, you see that the there is a 197 00:21:00,111 --> 00:21:06,550 maker space, there are spaces dedicated to disassembling, there are places to eat, to 198 00:21:06,550 --> 00:21:14,840 pray, to disassemble, to repair, to have fun. And also, we have the feeling that, 199 00:21:14,840 --> 00:21:21,880 well, these are just people discarding and dissecting our electronics. But actually, 200 00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:26,790 the way they work is very sophisticated and very fine. So first of all, they get 201 00:21:26,790 --> 00:21:31,650 these huge containers, that with content, pretty much anything we don't want that's 202 00:21:31,650 --> 00:21:37,300 electric or electronic, including entire cars. And they divide them in streams. So 203 00:21:37,300 --> 00:21:45,370 this is a heap of photocopy machines. They also can detect when something can't be 204 00:21:45,370 --> 00:21:52,230 repaired, but they also can detect which part of the machine all the computer is 205 00:21:52,230 --> 00:21:57,870 still, which component can be saved and reused to repair something else. So that 206 00:21:57,870 --> 00:22:05,150 also goes on another pile. I think they're much better than us at differentiating 207 00:22:05,150 --> 00:22:14,000 different types of plastics. They have places dedicated to weigh in the kind of 208 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:21,700 metal that they retrieve. And I would say that they're quite like you suddenly, not 209 00:22:21,700 --> 00:22:28,280 like me. So when I have a computer and it doesn't work. I think for me, it's a black 210 00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:33,140 box. I'm never going to open it. But these people, their job, their business is to 211 00:22:33,140 --> 00:22:38,810 open our old computers and better than that. Most of them, like not most of them, 212 00:22:38,810 --> 00:22:43,750 but many of them, can repair and give them a second life or really a new lease of 213 00:22:43,750 --> 00:22:51,070 life, which, you know, it's important because we think all these objects are 214 00:22:51,070 --> 00:22:54,660 dead, but actually they give them a second life and then, you know, they repair it. 215 00:22:54,660 --> 00:23:00,520 They repair them, they sell them to communities around Aghogbloshie or in 216 00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:05,130 Ghana, or in neighboring countries to people would otherwise not be able to 217 00:23:05,130 --> 00:23:11,821 afford a new printer or new TV or a computer. And then, as you can see, they 218 00:23:11,821 --> 00:23:21,800 have places to have fun. And they, too, are quite fans of the Premier League. So 219 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:27,790 the map I was showing, just before. With all the activities in Aghogbloshie has 220 00:23:27,790 --> 00:23:33,860 been made by architects and designers DK Osseo-Asare and Yasmina Abbas. They spent 221 00:23:33,860 --> 00:23:39,360 a lot of time trying to understand how the community was working. And they designed 222 00:23:39,360 --> 00:23:47,580 this kiosk with anything they could find on the scrapyard. And it's a meeting place 223 00:23:47,580 --> 00:23:54,240 where they invite the community of Aghogbloshie to meet people such as 224 00:23:54,240 --> 00:24:00,550 graduates or young students in science, technology, engineering, math. And so the 225 00:24:00,550 --> 00:24:07,740 students and graduates who have very, very theoretical vision on technology. And then 226 00:24:07,740 --> 00:24:13,730 they get to meet these people, who have extremely sophisticated, very deep, know 227 00:24:13,730 --> 00:24:20,630 how. And together they exchange ideas and they've developed ways, for example, you 228 00:24:20,630 --> 00:24:25,540 know, the traditional lead to to recover the copper from the cable, they would burn 229 00:24:25,540 --> 00:24:30,660 the cable, the plastic, which is very toxic and also damages the copper. So they 230 00:24:30,660 --> 00:24:36,540 find a way to recover the copper without burning the plastic, which means that it's 231 00:24:36,540 --> 00:24:42,980 less toxic, it's safer, and they can sell the copper for more money. So it's kind of 232 00:24:42,980 --> 00:24:50,650 a win-win. The aim was to develop together new processes, new ways of working, new 233 00:24:50,650 --> 00:24:56,540 tools. They also have fun. So with bits and pieces, they found on the scrap yard a 234 00:24:56,540 --> 00:25:02,150 couple of years ago they made these drones that flew over the junkyard. So it's a 235 00:25:02,150 --> 00:25:10,740 project I like a lot because it pays hommage to the kind of work that doesn't 236 00:25:10,740 --> 00:25:15,230 get a lot of recognition. But that's really important, you know, when you think 237 00:25:15,230 --> 00:25:22,110 of, as I said, the metals we are using to make our electronics and also even the 238 00:25:22,110 --> 00:25:28,890 solar panels and and the wind turbine et cetera, and all our renewable energy they 239 00:25:28,890 --> 00:25:35,850 also rely on the same metals that are disappearing, at least are becoming less 240 00:25:35,850 --> 00:25:39,590 available. So that's one of the reasons I really like this project. And also, it 241 00:25:39,590 --> 00:25:46,530 reminded me of this performance from already forty years ago by Mierle Laderman 242 00:25:46,530 --> 00:25:54,230 Ukeles. She kind of decided she would be an artist in residency at the New York 243 00:25:54,230 --> 00:26:00,420 Department of Sanitation. So that's the people who collect the trash. So she spent 244 00:26:00,420 --> 00:26:05,980 a year with them everyday. She was there at six in the morning and she followed 245 00:26:05,980 --> 00:26:10,720 them and she did, she had this gesture of she wanted to meet every single one of 246 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:16,140 them. There were 8500 employees. So she she wanted to shake them with them and 247 00:26:16,140 --> 00:26:21,060 say, thank you for keeping New York City alive. Which I think is a lovely gesture, 248 00:26:21,060 --> 00:26:25,959 because suddenly this anonymous mass of bin men you realize that there are 249 00:26:25,959 --> 00:26:33,580 individuals. And yeah, she documented and talked with them. It's a way to bring 250 00:26:33,580 --> 00:26:39,549 attention to a profession that we don't value a lot. And also, she wanted by 251 00:26:39,549 --> 00:26:44,630 spending so much time among them to make people realize that the work of these 252 00:26:44,630 --> 00:26:50,559 people should be valued at least as much as her own as an artist because of the 253 00:26:50,559 --> 00:26:58,500 role they play for the collective society. Yeah. Okay. I see. Still Agbogbloshie 254 00:26:58,500 --> 00:27:04,500 but if I had time I would talk about other projects in Africa. This one's a startup. 255 00:27:04,500 --> 00:27:10,059 African born 3D that makes 3D printers that at least a third of the components 256 00:27:10,059 --> 00:27:20,930 come are found in second hand on second hand, in discarded electronic let's say. 257 00:27:20,930 --> 00:27:26,320 And I think what this show is, is a kind of mindset and an attitude that should 258 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:32,000 inspire us. And it's going to show to show you a few example of this attitude, I 259 00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:37,360 think is really important is is trying to make the most of what you have instead of 260 00:27:37,360 --> 00:27:44,290 jumping on the next gadget and gizmo, but really trying to to be as creative, as 261 00:27:44,290 --> 00:27:49,410 innovative as possible. So in India, they have this movement called Jugaad, 262 00:27:49,410 --> 00:27:56,870 where even in the West we translate it as frugal innovation. So this 263 00:27:56,870 --> 00:28:03,420 is. Oh yeah. You needed. You had only a motorcycle. You need a ploughing machine 264 00:28:03,420 --> 00:28:11,260 for his land. So you adapted. The the the is motorcycle. And you turn it into a kind 265 00:28:11,260 --> 00:28:28,550 of. *sudden silence* 266 00:28:28,550 --> 00:28:34,870 RD: I can take a traveling mic Audio technician: Dead battery. 267 00:28:34,870 --> 00:28:41,230 RD: So I should keep ... watch out for my hair, yeah. 268 00:28:41,230 --> 00:28:47,191 Herald: In the meantime, the question. You know it. Oh, no. I think the meantime is 269 00:28:47,191 --> 00:28:53,440 over. No. So, uh, you know the question. And you know the case 6-2-1. Someone? No? 270 00:28:53,440 --> 00:29:02,660 So six hours of sleep a day. Two meals? No. Oh, boring. Anyways, to remember it: 271 00:29:02,660 --> 00:29:09,040 six hours of sleep, two meals a day and one shower, please remember. And, uh, to 272 00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:14,140 make some minor announcements, don't forget the trash. Do we have audio back? 273 00:29:14,140 --> 00:29:17,540 RD: I think so. Herald: Perfect. Then, please. 274 00:29:17,540 --> 00:29:26,500 RD: I can't believe you told people to wash. Yeah. Yeah. This is answering 275 00:29:26,500 --> 00:29:32,350 precise need instead of creating demand. And sometimes, you know, it respond to a 276 00:29:32,350 --> 00:29:40,520 specific problem. Sometimes it can be scaled up. So this Indian inventor made a 277 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:46,809 fridge that doesn't use electricity, but uses evaporation to to keep the food cool 278 00:29:46,809 --> 00:29:51,250 simply because there are people who live in a rural areas who don't necessarily can 279 00:29:51,250 --> 00:29:58,100 afford a fridge or don't have continuous access to electricity. And of course, the 280 00:29:58,100 --> 00:30:02,370 best example and the most famous example of Jugaad, is the Indian 281 00:30:02,370 --> 00:30:12,710 space mission. Since 2014 India has is a probe orbiting Mars and the Indian 282 00:30:12,710 --> 00:30:18,610 engineers, and pretty much everybody in India jokes about the fact that it costs 283 00:30:18,610 --> 00:30:23,549 less money for them, that the space mission cost less money than than your 284 00:30:23,549 --> 00:30:31,160 average Hollywood blockbuster about space. And, you know, it's not about making 285 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:42,510 things cheap. It's about reinventing process, of designing, of manufacturing 286 00:30:42,510 --> 00:30:48,070 and of distributing. Okay. I don't have that much time. So I'm going to skip a few 287 00:30:48,070 --> 00:30:56,700 things. Yes. So I've been to India, Africa. Let's get back to to Asia, because 288 00:30:56,700 --> 00:31:01,880 I really like this project. Say it's a project by an artist who also saw images 289 00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:06,799 from Agbogbloshien similar a junkyards. And so he was interested in 290 00:31:06,799 --> 00:31:11,700 e-waste as well. He found himself in Taiwan and he found this really cutting 291 00:31:11,700 --> 00:31:18,260 edge company that deals with e-waste no one wants. So usually when you find a 292 00:31:18,260 --> 00:31:25,260 company that deals with recycling midsize, usually they focus on the nice metals, the 293 00:31:25,260 --> 00:31:30,569 ones that are valuable like in a copper, for example. And then you have pieces of 294 00:31:30,569 --> 00:31:39,250 electronic waste that no one wants, such as a I don't know the one that contains 295 00:31:39,250 --> 00:31:47,610 lead or CRT monitors or glass fiber from printed electronic boards. This kind of 296 00:31:47,610 --> 00:31:51,480 thing that really no one knows what to do with it. Well, they found a way. So the 297 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:59,650 company is called Super Dragon Technology. And the trick they found is 298 00:31:59,650 --> 00:32:05,660 that they just take all these bits and pieces of waste that no one wants and they 299 00:32:05,660 --> 00:32:09,970 crush them into a powder, they mix them with epoxy and they make these splendid 300 00:32:09,970 --> 00:32:15,759 objects out of them. And because I think they're quite crafty, they can imitate 301 00:32:15,759 --> 00:32:21,570 very well the appearance of bronze, of marble, of porcelain, you know, very noble 302 00:32:21,570 --> 00:32:27,520 material. And also they play with the proportion of epoxy and this toxic powder 303 00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:32,110 to make it so like feel like it's very heavy if it's supposed to imitate bronze, 304 00:32:32,110 --> 00:32:37,500 etc. And so they're decorative objects with the particularity that they contain a 305 00:32:37,500 --> 00:32:41,460 lot of lead. So you're not supposed to manipulate them too much might be 306 00:32:41,460 --> 00:32:47,230 dangerous. They also have in common that they have a very peculiar esthetic. As you 307 00:32:47,230 --> 00:32:54,250 can see, this is a trophy. And then have these these wonderful little thing where 308 00:32:54,250 --> 00:33:00,970 they actually they make fake rocks, which looks absolutely eccentric and crazy. But 309 00:33:00,970 --> 00:33:05,890 the story is that these are not just any type of rocks. They're supposed to be 310 00:33:05,890 --> 00:33:14,450 scholar stone. So during the tense 11th and 12th century in China, there was the 311 00:33:14,450 --> 00:33:21,710 dispassion for the so-called scholar stone where an intellectual from China would go 312 00:33:21,710 --> 00:33:25,360 in the countryside and admire the landscape. And suddenly they would find 313 00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:29,860 these rocks that were seemed to be sculpted by the elements that had really 314 00:33:29,860 --> 00:33:35,230 strange and interesting shapes. And they thought it was the manifestation of the 315 00:33:35,230 --> 00:33:40,610 creativity of nature. And so they would bring them back and use them to 316 00:33:40,610 --> 00:33:44,700 contemplate and meditate. And, you know, now nowadays you can you can still buy 317 00:33:44,700 --> 00:33:51,731 some of these scholar stones in auction. They're quite valuable. But what I really, 318 00:33:51,731 --> 00:33:58,679 really like is that these superb dragon technology is the way they think. So they 319 00:33:58,679 --> 00:34:04,360 can figure out that there's a difference between applied art that makes you do 320 00:34:04,360 --> 00:34:10,710 useful things like plates and furniture and then fine art that makes basically 321 00:34:10,710 --> 00:34:16,649 useless things and sees the ways no one wants is useless. Well, that kinds of 322 00:34:16,649 --> 00:34:21,800 fits with the requirement to make fine art. So this way all these objects have 323 00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:25,819 been shown showing to you. They call them green art and they have a green art 324 00:34:25,819 --> 00:34:30,310 gallery, and appearantly it's quite successful. Tyler Coburn bought some of 325 00:34:30,310 --> 00:34:36,919 these stones and actually accompanies them with a text. So I know your narrative 326 00:34:36,919 --> 00:34:41,840 where you have the story of one single grain of sand that tells its many stories 327 00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:47,210 how it started as a sand and then became became a piece of electronics and then a 328 00:34:47,210 --> 00:34:54,759 piece of trash and then and then ended its life as art. Found it very charming. I 329 00:34:54,759 --> 00:35:01,850 don't have time for this. Yes. Very quickly. I mean, I'm famous for giving 330 00:35:01,850 --> 00:35:06,750 very depressing talks. So now I'm trying to insert a little bit of happiness in my 331 00:35:06,750 --> 00:35:12,860 talks. Things are changing a bit. That's why you have now repair cafes that are 332 00:35:12,860 --> 00:35:16,990 quite successful, yet there are also shops you can find where the people working 333 00:35:16,990 --> 00:35:21,300 there and absolutely not affiliated with with Apple, Samsung and Nokia. But they 334 00:35:21,300 --> 00:35:26,099 found a way to give a second life to your objects and repair them. So and usually 335 00:35:26,099 --> 00:35:31,490 they are much nicer than the guys at the Genius Bar. If you've ever had to deal 336 00:35:31,490 --> 00:35:38,599 with them. There are more and more Web sites that sell secondhand goods that have 337 00:35:38,599 --> 00:35:42,950 that even come with a one year warranty. You've heard about the fairphone, of 338 00:35:42,950 --> 00:35:50,320 course. And then brings me quite abruptly to the other type of waste I wanted to 339 00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:55,010 talk about, which is nuclear waste. I thought I saw that I needed to talk about 340 00:35:55,010 --> 00:35:59,380 nuclear waste because because it's waste, because it's energy. And so it's very 341 00:35:59,380 --> 00:36:06,420 technological and extremely problematic. So what do you do when you have your 342 00:36:06,420 --> 00:36:12,400 country and you have a lot of nuclear waste? I mean, the most toxic can be toxic 343 00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:19,500 for 100.000 years, up to a million years. It's going to be very, very dangerous. You 344 00:36:19,500 --> 00:36:25,390 have two choices. Either you keep it at hand like buried, but not too deep so that 345 00:36:25,390 --> 00:36:30,341 you hope that in the near future someone will have a brilliant idea and be able to 346 00:36:30,341 --> 00:36:36,090 we'll know what to do with it and how to handle it safely. Or else you do like they 347 00:36:36,090 --> 00:36:40,180 are doing in in Finland and in other countries. And France is thinking about 348 00:36:40,180 --> 00:36:47,950 that. You bury them very, very deep under the ground in deep geological repository. 349 00:36:47,950 --> 00:36:53,010 But then you have a problem because it's going to be to be dangerous for thousands 350 00:36:53,010 --> 00:37:00,430 of years. So how do you inform people, like a future generation that it's dangerous 351 00:37:00,430 --> 00:37:07,890 and they shouldn't go nearby. Either you use text, but then languages change, 352 00:37:07,890 --> 00:37:11,599 languages disappear. I mean, we might think that, oh, everybody speaks English, 353 00:37:11,599 --> 00:37:17,651 but everybody used to speak a bit of Latin. And now if you are confronted with 354 00:37:17,651 --> 00:37:23,240 the text of Latin, you might not find it easy to understand, even if your mother 355 00:37:23,240 --> 00:37:28,640 language is English. Dealing with with an English text from the middle age is going 356 00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:32,200 to be difficult. I speak French dealing with the with a French text from the 357 00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:39,390 middle age is difficult. So how about having some nice icons such as the skull 358 00:37:39,390 --> 00:37:43,460 and crossbones like everybody, you would think that everybody associated with 359 00:37:43,460 --> 00:37:49,990 toxicity. Absolutely not. It's quite it's quite new. It's only since the 1800 that 360 00:37:49,990 --> 00:37:54,400 the skull and crossbones have been associated with toxicity. In the middle 361 00:37:54,400 --> 00:38:00,280 age Christians when they saw Skull and Bones they tought of renewal and 362 00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:07,560 resirection. And I guess if you show the children the skull and crossbones there, 363 00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:12,140 they they're not going to see toxicity. They are going to say, oh, cool, pirate's 364 00:38:12,140 --> 00:38:17,910 Treasure Island. So you see, that's tricky. Yeah, the symbols. So I am going 365 00:38:17,910 --> 00:38:22,710 to show a couple of ideas that semioticians and artists and philosophers 366 00:38:22,710 --> 00:38:30,230 and thinkers have thought about to deal with how to signal to very, very distant 367 00:38:30,230 --> 00:38:33,760 generations that there is something special there and you shouldn't go near 368 00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:40,900 it. Oh yeah. Okay, I forgot this one. Even if you found a suitable message, let's say 369 00:38:40,900 --> 00:38:44,510 you found a suitable message. You also have to make sure that people would take 370 00:38:44,510 --> 00:38:51,750 it seriously. The thing, the coastline off of Japan, there are these so-called 371 00:38:51,750 --> 00:38:56,170 tsunami stones that basically say, please don't build beyond this point because it's 372 00:38:56,170 --> 00:38:59,690 very dangerous. There's been a tsunami. They will come back one day and no one 373 00:38:59,690 --> 00:39:07,270 paid attention. Anyway, let's go back to my artist and semioticians idea. So in the 374 00:39:07,270 --> 00:39:14,200 early 80s, a semiotician had the idea of, you know, to preserve the memory of the 375 00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:20,170 presence of a very toxic, very dangerous nuclear waste, you have to make it part of 376 00:39:20,170 --> 00:39:25,310 society to include it in the fabric of society. So, he suggested the creation of 377 00:39:25,310 --> 00:39:31,590 an atomic priesthood. So that would be a religious order that would have as its 378 00:39:31,590 --> 00:39:37,740 mission to keep the memory of the danger alive, using rituals and myths and 379 00:39:37,740 --> 00:39:44,840 folklore. Some artists thought, well, we should plan the forest like a forest of 380 00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:50,920 genetically modified trees on top of one of those repositories, so that in the 381 00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:55,450 autumn the leaves would bloom and become blue and that they would fall and that 382 00:39:55,450 --> 00:40:01,750 there would be a nice blue carpet. And people like in thousands of years would 383 00:40:01,750 --> 00:40:05,160 interpret it as: oh this is a secret place, we should leave it in peace and 384 00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:09,740 respect it. I really love this idea. I find it a bit naive because, you know, 385 00:40:09,740 --> 00:40:15,609 human beings don't have a great track record of respecting beautiful pieces of 386 00:40:15,609 --> 00:40:21,590 landscape. So, yeah, I'm not very optimistic. Yeah, and then there is this 387 00:40:21,590 --> 00:40:30,780 kind of cynical idea of modifying a cat so that the cat would stop glowing or 388 00:40:30,780 --> 00:40:36,070 changing the color of its fur in the presence of high red. Oh, 20 minutes 389 00:40:36,070 --> 00:40:43,470 again. Keep adding time. But I'm almost done anyway. So that would be a cat that 390 00:40:43,470 --> 00:40:49,340 changes color or glow in the presence of radioactivity. This is not one of those 391 00:40:49,340 --> 00:40:59,200 cats this is an artistic interpretation of Marcel Rickli. So yeah, I think it's not 392 00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:10,660 very nice. To be honest with you, I like all those ideas of trying to transmit and 393 00:41:10,660 --> 00:41:17,021 connect with very, very distant time and with people who are living in moments, in 394 00:41:17,021 --> 00:41:23,390 times we cannot even comprehend and imagine. But I'm not totally convinced. 395 00:41:23,390 --> 00:41:27,670 And I mean, they're charming, but I don't think they would stand the test of deep 396 00:41:27,670 --> 00:41:34,680 time, mostly because it just that the periods we're talking about, like even 397 00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:40,720 100.000 years, it goes beyond human experience. How do you relate to it? It's 398 00:41:40,720 --> 00:41:46,860 just so far away that it becomes abstract and almost unreal. So I've been thinking, 399 00:41:46,860 --> 00:41:50,260 you know, about this project. I've been interested in nuclear waste for quite a 400 00:41:50,260 --> 00:41:56,930 few years now. So I've been thinking other projects, artistic or others, that can 401 00:41:56,930 --> 00:42:03,570 relate to, like physically or emotionally, with very, very distant past, but in the 402 00:42:03,570 --> 00:42:06,960 distant times, but in the past, because we don't know the future, we don't know what 403 00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:12,130 it's going to be like. But the past, we kind of have an idea. I couldn't find any 404 00:42:12,130 --> 00:42:17,660 project that really, that I was convinced could give a good experience, a good idea 405 00:42:17,660 --> 00:42:24,190 of relating to a distant time in the past. Until last month, there was this big art 406 00:42:24,190 --> 00:42:33,000 fair in Turin and I found this butt plug by a Swedish artist called Thomas Hämén. 407 00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:37,950 And the particularity of this butt plug is that it's made of copper light. So it's 408 00:42:37,950 --> 00:42:46,130 basically dinosaur poo from around 140 million years ago. And that's where I 409 00:42:46,130 --> 00:42:53,380 discovered that there is actually a big market for the incredible, for fossilized 410 00:42:53,380 --> 00:42:59,080 dinosaur excrements. You can buy it. I checked. You can buy it on Amazon. I'm not 411 00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:03,730 sure it's going to be an authentic, but it's available on Amazon. So I thought, 412 00:43:03,730 --> 00:43:08,490 yeah, that's it. I mean, if you were to buy it and use it, you would actually be 413 00:43:08,490 --> 00:43:15,090 in close connection with a living creature that, I mean, in intimate contact, I could 414 00:43:15,090 --> 00:43:24,330 say, with a creature that lived at a very, very distant time. Okay. So, we are almost 415 00:43:24,330 --> 00:43:30,200 at the end. I have three lines of conclusion that I'm going to read. But 416 00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:37,590 then I want to show you a film. And my conclusion would be that all of this is 417 00:43:37,590 --> 00:43:43,670 very fanciful, especially the end. But it might still be useful to keep in mind that 418 00:43:43,670 --> 00:43:50,020 something like renewable energy that keeps us so, so passionate, is very often viewed 419 00:43:50,020 --> 00:43:55,330 as a long term solution to the climate emergency. But unfortunately, renewable 420 00:43:55,330 --> 00:44:01,350 energy relies on physical resources that are neither infinite nor renewable. And 421 00:44:01,350 --> 00:44:05,859 right now, it looks like we are busy implementing a future that was dreamt and 422 00:44:05,859 --> 00:44:12,450 conceived a few decades ago. At a time when society wasn't worried about 423 00:44:12,450 --> 00:44:20,450 exploding climate crises, the erasure of wildlife and growing material scarcity 424 00:44:20,450 --> 00:44:27,369 accompanied by an unmanageable heaps of waste. Anyway, I've just been talking 425 00:44:27,369 --> 00:44:36,180 about the future and I would like to end with a short movie set in the future by 426 00:44:36,180 --> 00:44:45,630 Alexandra Lupashko, who is a young Russian filmmaker. And I really wanted to show it 427 00:44:45,630 --> 00:44:51,170 to you for several reasons. One of them is that when I knew I would come back, my 428 00:44:51,170 --> 00:44:55,280 first thought is that, yes, I'm going to be able to show 2050, because I really 429 00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:58,900 love it. And the second reason is that I really didn't want to finish my 430 00:44:58,900 --> 00:45:05,120 presentation with a butt plug. *laughter* 431 00:45:11,980 --> 00:45:35,110 (Video starts playing) *Music* 432 00:45:53,270 --> 00:46:06,305 *Music* 433 00:47:11,476 --> 00:47:21,100 *loud heartbeet* 434 00:47:59,285 --> 00:48:02,880 *laughter in the audience* 435 00:48:04,935 --> 00:48:06,915 *sound of a shot* 436 00:48:09,507 --> 00:48:14,937 *applause* 437 00:48:14,937 --> 00:48:33,720 *music* 438 00:48:51,360 --> 00:49:04,180 Yeah.. *applause* Yeah. I forget to say it had nothing to do 439 00:49:04,180 --> 00:49:11,100 with waste, but it was just irresistible, I had to show it to you. Okay, that's it 440 00:49:11,100 --> 00:49:17,459 for me. Unless you have questions. Herald: Thank you very much, Régine 441 00:49:17,459 --> 00:49:30,450 Débatty. *applause* As usual, if you have questions, we have microphones over there 442 00:49:30,450 --> 00:49:35,860 and microphones over there. Please stand in line. And of course, we have questions 443 00:49:35,860 --> 00:49:43,250 from the Internet. OK. In the meantime, small thing. If you want to read, know 444 00:49:43,250 --> 00:49:48,510 about.... Sorry, if you want to read more about Régine. She writes also on a 445 00:49:48,510 --> 00:49:51,810 website. It's called "We Make Money, not Art dot com" 446 00:49:51,810 --> 00:49:55,390 [https://we-make-money-not-art.com]. Which is, at least if I am concerned, a 447 00:49:55,390 --> 00:50:01,420 brilliant title. And you write about what? Régine: I've been writing, I mean, I think 448 00:50:01,420 --> 00:50:06,660 is for almost 16 years about the way designers, artists and hackers are using 449 00:50:06,660 --> 00:50:11,970 science and technology in a creative but more importantly socially engaged way. So 450 00:50:11,970 --> 00:50:17,790 it's quite political, I like to think. Herald: Which suits perfectly to this to 451 00:50:17,790 --> 00:50:19,690 this event. Régine: Yeah. 452 00:50:19,690 --> 00:50:27,810 Herald: So questions? I see none so far. None so far. In this case, we can... 453 00:50:27,810 --> 00:50:31,579 Number four is this. Microphone 4: Um. 454 00:50:31,579 --> 00:50:38,640 Herald: Now in this case ... I heard an, um. No question. In this case, we can chat 455 00:50:38,640 --> 00:50:43,230 a little bit more about your website. Régine: Okay 456 00:50:43,230 --> 00:50:46,099 Herald: So if you want. If you want. Régine: Yeah. It's not going to interest 457 00:50:46,099 --> 00:50:48,099 people. Herald: I'm pretty sure it does. 458 00:50:48,099 --> 00:50:50,400 Régine: Okay. Herald: Because I had a quick look and it 459 00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:54,520 was pretty impressive. You write about AI as far as I know. 460 00:50:54,520 --> 00:50:59,519 Régine: That's the thing. When I knew I was coming to talk about the best of 2019. 461 00:50:59,519 --> 00:51:04,820 I was like, this year I've had to deal so much with AI outside of my blog that I 462 00:51:04,820 --> 00:51:09,500 said "no more AI" except maybe for the film at the end, that, you know, is a bit 463 00:51:09,500 --> 00:51:13,460 AI, but otherwise... Herald. No AI? 464 00:51:13,460 --> 00:51:17,850 Régine: Yeah. On my blog, there's been a lot of AI. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a bit sick of 465 00:51:17,850 --> 00:51:23,480 it. Actually, one of the last ... I wrote about was by Julian Oliver who spoke just 466 00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:30,230 before me now. Yeah. Herald: Cool. In this case, no more 467 00:51:30,230 --> 00:51:34,140 questions. Thank you very much. Please, a warm applause for Jean. 468 00:51:34,140 --> 00:51:37,970 *applause* 469 00:51:37,970 --> 00:51:41,449 *postroll music* 470 00:51:41,449 --> 00:52:05,000 subtitles created by c3subtitles.de in the year 2020. Join, and help us!